Aerial Transport and Embarking

Rules discussions and clarifications.
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farrier
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Aerial Transport and Embarking

Post by farrier »

1. Under Embarking and Disembarking it states that a squad needs to be in coherency and have one unit finish its move within 2" of a transport to embark.

Later, under Aerial Transports, it states that an aerial transport that hasn't moved more than 1/2 MV can land, referring to the Aircraft section for details, and immediately embark any units in range. After it has done so it may take off.

But then under the Aircraft Landing section it states that an aircraft cannot land with 2" of non- infantry units.

I'm struggling with the exact sequence that is used to embark vehicles. In order to embark two Bears into a Condor, if the Condor flies 1/2 MV then lands, it can't be within the 2" of the Bears to embark them, which means that the Bears will have to use a move to get closer, in which case the Condor will have finished it's move and won't be able to take off until it is activated next turn, rendering it a bit susceptible to ground fire.

Have I got that sequence right?

2. It looks like disembarking allows a full turn of movement, plus the 2" deployment from the transport, can a unit use full MV to get to a transport for embarking? I'm sure it used to be half?

Thanks

farrier

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TimeWizard
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Re: Aerial Transport and Embarking

Post by TimeWizard »

1. The Aerial Transport rule says "After the units embark or disembark, the Aerial Transport can choose to take off again, ending its Moving action in the air as normal."

2. Yes it would seem the 1/2 Mv value for embarking or disembarking has been removed, so the unit(s) could move their full Mv value. And since squads may not shoot before embarking, you don't have to worry about being restricted to the M&F distance.

Aladinn
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Re: Aerial Transport and Embarking

Post by Aladinn »

according to the rules, airial transports can only disembark and embark when doing a 1/2 move. Ground transports can do a full move.

The 2 inch distance rule is a problem when embarking units like you state. In the current wording it is impossible to land and directly embark units and take off again as you got to finish the activation of the transport first before moving the ground units. This means it can't take off again unit next turn. Note that this is only for vehicles, not infantry (you can land within 2 inch of infantry). Looks like another oversight in the rules I think.

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TimeWizard
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Re: Aerial Transport and Embarking

Post by TimeWizard »

The Aerial Transport can take off again after units embark or disembark. What it cannot do is move some distance, disembark aunits, then move some more. This was allowed in V 1 and in the Beta rules, no idea why it was taken out. The changed the embark/disembark distance from 3" for vehicles and 1" for infantry to 2" for everything.

farrier
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Re: Aerial Transport and Embarking

Post by farrier »

TimeWizard wrote:
Sat Jun 22, 2019 11:30 am
The changed the embark/disembark distance from 3" for vehicles and 1" for infantry to 2" for everything.
It's that change that has caused the problem, a transport can no longer land close enough to a vehicle to embark it

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TimeWizard
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Re: Aerial Transport and Embarking

Post by TimeWizard »

Yes, the transport would have to end it's move and land. Then the vehicle squad can use a moving action to move 1 unit to within 2" and then embark. After that the only 'move' the aerial transport is allowed is to again take off and end it's move in the air. A bit too confusing.

However, something to consider. The rules says the transport cannot land "within 2" of a friendly vehicle" so what if you land exactly 2" from a vehicle unit, then it embarks (a free move) then the transport takes off again and completes it's move action up to 1/2 its move value measured from where it began the turn?

farrier
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Re: Aerial Transport and Embarking

Post by farrier »

TimeWizard wrote:
Sat Jun 22, 2019 3:19 pm
Yes, the transport would have to end it's move and land. Then the vehicle squad can use a moving action to move 1 unit to within 2" and then embark. After that the only 'move' the aerial transport is allowed is to again take off and end it's move in the air. A bit too confusing.

However, something to consider. The rules says the transport cannot land "within 2" of a friendly vehicle" so what if you land exactly 2" from a vehicle unit, then it embarks (a free move) then the transport takes off again and completes it's move action up to 1/2 its move value measured from where it began the turn?
After re-reading many times I agree, it does appear to be saying that Aerial Transport gets a special take-off move after embarking, it's just not very clear.

Landing at 2" exactly would work if 'within 2"' is defined as 'up to 2"' however there is no reason that I can see to force this exact measurement. Aerial Transports should be allowed to land within 1" of infantry and vehicles. Hopefully it will be cleared up with an FAQ

Wep'tak
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Re: Aerial Transport and Embarking

Post by Wep'tak »

farrier wrote:
Sat Jun 22, 2019 9:27 pm
Aerial Transports should be allowed to land within 1" of infantry and vehicles.
That or make an exception for the units that are embarking.

Dark_Fox
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Re: Aerial Transport and Embarking

Post by Dark_Fox »

Answer to OP + observations
1) The combination of rules seems to be aimed at limiting leap frog tactics with vehicles without some relatively risky transport parking.

It is true that aerial transports cannot land and freely embark vehicles up due to the 2" landing zone.
The rule stating you can embark units for free still works for infantry so I think it's more geared towards them.
Your sequence of events is correct. At least from my understanding.
Note it does still appear you can leap frog vehicles provided the aerial started it's activation landed (and survived being a sitting duck)
The sequence would go like so: Bears move up within 2" and embark themselves - condor takes off and moves 9" and lands again - disembarks for free - takes off again.
As far as i can see there is no limit to a unit both embarking and disembarking in the same turn in this way except they won't be able to shoot due to having embarked as usual. It is unclear to me whether the bears embarking themselves would make the condor count as using it's embark OR disembark for the turn. I am erring towards no due to aerials seeming to have an "active disembark" where they can basically eject loaded units. All other transports require the units in them to disembark as part of moving.


Maybe the ability of transports to drop off assets and quickly duck out of firing range/arcs in 1st edition caused enough dissatisfaction that this time around they deliberately curbed it?

Just my thoughts, would welcome discussion if wrong.

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